PHIL's play in History

Its a fun topic for me and one that people discuss in the golf world. I for one don't rate Vardon, Jones, Young and old Tom Morris, Sarazen and Hagan in comparison to our modern golfers. They used different equipment but also they played before the modern PGA tour took shape around 1940 or so. Heck Jones really only played three or four tournaments a year. So rating the top ten or twenty, of all time, IMO starts in 1940 or so. Here goes

1st Jack
2nd Tiger
3rd Hogan (the what ifs with Hogan are amazing but we can't rate on what ifs)
4th Player--gets major credit for Majors
5th Snead--In some ways because of his many PGA wins I might rate him ahead of Player but he has the grand slam
6th Palmer-not as many majors as Tom Watson but more PGA wins.
7th Tom Watson Yes lots of majors but IMO Open Championships in his era were diminished as some of the best US players did not come to UK
8th PHIL 6 Majors but so many more PGA wins then Faldo, Trevino and others. I can argue he might be ahead of Watson due to PGA wins, top three finishes in majors and length of career
9th Nelson --lots of PGA wins against diminished fields . He retired early so has many many what ifs. Can't rate on what ifs.
10th--Trevino/Faldo -lots of majors not enough PGA or Euro wins.

Fun PHIL fact--PHIL now has 454 birdies at the Masters. Nicklaus has the most with 508. PHIL had 21 birdies this week and at age 52 likely could play 10 or more of these events. I like PHIL's chances of getting this long time record. He also has 19 eagles at the Masters--Jack leads with 22 but despite having something 9 eagle putts this week he did not make any so wait till next year.

1. Jones
2. Nicklaus
3. Woods
4. Hagen
5. Hogan
6. Player
7. Nelson
8. Sarazen
9. Snead
10. Watson
11. Palmer
12. Mickelson

Winning today would have kept Phil at 12. It was meaningless for his career (though would have been the ultimate FUCK YOU to Jay the dunce Monahan).

A US Open win would move Phil up to 7 or 8 all time. Had he won today, he'd need to win another major to move up above Palmer and maybe Watson

https://www.thealltimegreatestgolfers.com/top30

I've always enjoyed this list (maybe because it ranks Phil highly, lol). Weights different elements and tries to tie the whole thing together. It's subjective of course, given all the different variables and difficulties of judging players over time.

One thing about Phil, look at all those top 3 finishes in majors. 12 second places really hurts (maybe needs to be updated to 13 now!) the way his career is viewed. Looking a lot of the other top players, they won more compared to their second and third place finishes, whereas Phil has more seconds than anyone except Jack and is right up there in third place finishes too.

There is a somewhat random element to golf, given you can't control what other people do. Makes you wonder, if Phil had the last 30 years over, even just a different random chance, what his numbers could look like. It wouldn't take a huge lot to shift him to 10 majors and that would totally change the way he's viewed.

Phil blew several majors in his 40s and had some outright stolen from him

He blew Pebble in 2010 putting like a weekend hack
Blew the back 9 at St Georges in 2011 by missing short putts
Blew Augusta 2012 by that AWFUL course management decision of blowing it left on 4. Just hit the green and he has the jacket!
Don't get me started with his putting at Marion!
Rory with the horseshoe up his ass at Valhalla. Somehow shooting 16 under to pip Phil by 1
Phil shoots 14 under at Augusta only to be defeated
17 under at Troon and somehow still loses!
Phil forgetting his putter yesterday morning and not finding it until about 3:30 in the afternoon

Those are just since he turned 40. 8 majors more he could have very easily won

If one is talking a career then yes I like these type of statistical analysis. Longevity counts for something right?

Yes, Merion really hurt because it felt like one Phil left behind and it was the US Open where he's had so many close painful calls. Troon hurts but for a different reason, Phil was genuinely freakishly unlucky to come up against one of the most inspired major performances ever from anyone in Stenson. These things add up.

In another life, Phil gets an early major win and doesn't have to live with being the best player without a major pressure for the guts of a decade. In that life he probably has a few majors on the board before 2004.

I definitely think longevity has to count for something. Phil was t6 at the PGA in 93, 30 years later he's second at the Masters with an incredible career in between. Has there ever been anyone that good for that long?

Phil's standing power is without equal. 31 years between wins 1991 to 2022!. T6 in PGA 1993 and tied for second in Masters in 2023. Oh yes Troon, Merion, Wing Foot, 2001 PGA plus others at Augusta and various US Opens. Another major or just a US Open would be massive for PHIL. Still waiting for the Major that just falls into his lap as so far he has had to go out and capture it.

It was interesting reading the analysis. Just like the old days.Phil said he has a chance to make history at his age so hopefully the final majors he'll make some noise!

Blade92 wrote:Yes, Merion really hurt because it felt like one Phil left behind and it was the US Open where he's had so many close painful calls. Troon hurts but for a different reason, Phil was genuinely freakishly unlucky to come up against one of the most inspired major performances ever from anyone in Stenson. These things add up.

In another life, Phil gets an early major win and doesn't have to live with being the best player without a major pressure for the guts of a decade. In that life he probably has a few majors on the board before 2004.

I definitely think longevity has to count for something. Phil was t6 at the PGA in 93, 30 years later he's second at the Masters with an incredible career in between. Has there ever been anyone that good for that long?

Nicklaus is the only other player who has this much longevity. Finished T2 at the 1960 US Open to 6th at 1998 Masters. Watson also close. How did that geezer hit an 8 iron 200 yards over the green on 18 to lose the 2009 Open at 59?